http://victoriavandal.livejournal.com/ ([identity profile] victoriavandal.livejournal.com) wrote in [community profile] revolution_fr2008-09-16 10:55 am

Some people build model ships...

But this man.... http://boisdejustice.com/Home/Home.html
Hmm...!
If you can lightly skip over his take on the Revolution (he knows a lot about guillotines, but evidently not much about the 1790's!) the history page has a pre-1925 fire photo of the Paris guillotine blade and lunette. There was a fire in 1925 that destroyed Madame Tussauds in London, including, sadly, most of the Revolution and Napoleon artefacts, but the blade survived, though damaged - I don't know what became of the lunette (I last went when I was 5 or 6!). I suppose you have to take their word for it that it's the one: it's now billed as 'the blade that killed Marie-Antoinette' (and I bet they were tempted to add 'like in the movie'?), but if that's the case parts, if not all of it, must also have been used to kill - well, pretty well everyone that everyone here is interested in...which is a weird and horrible thought...
http://boisdejustice.com/History/History.html
(btw in case you didn't know, Tussaud also allegedly took Robespierre's 'death mask' -the Parisian place that makes copies believes it was actually taken in life, which is plausible - Washington had his cast in life, as did many politicians, poets etc. - but billing it as taken at the foot of the guillotine sounds more dramatic! http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/dec/01/france.art )
Gosh, I'm morbid today!

[identity profile] estellacat.livejournal.com 2008-09-16 01:48 pm (UTC)(link)
According to the historian Antoine de Baecque, the death mask in Mme Tussaud's could not have been made from life, as has often been asserted--a rather persistent legend. This is because the Thermidorians expressly prevented it from being made: "Contrary to the legends that were spread, not only was no death mask of Robespierre taken in wax, before or after the execution, but we also find in the archives of the two committees, the Committee of Public Safety and the Committee of General Security, an order of 10 Thermidor 'relative to the disposing of the conspirators." It recommends "the acquisition of a great quantity of time,' of which, it then says, "a substantial layer will be spread over the remains of the tyrants to corrupt them and prevent them from one day being deified." A series of measures is thus taken in the immediacy of events. The final disappearance of the corpses of the Robespierrists must be hastened, the Incorruptible corrupted: decomposition of the bodies is accelerated, the communal ditch of the Errancis closely guarded, as well as the Rue du Rocher, which leads to it, to avoid any theft of "relics," and a death mask is prohibited, setting this apart from other famous victims of the guillotine, executions in the course of which the executioners were less scrupulous." (de Baecque, trans. Charlotte Mandell, Glory and Terror pp. 150-1)

As to its having been taken in life, well, it's possible I suppose. But it's no less possible that it was made from memory with his portrait as a guide.

[identity profile] marieclaire08.livejournal.com 2008-09-18 04:42 pm (UTC)(link)
I would suggest that the chance of a death mask or a life mask ever having been made is almost nil. The market for artifacts has always been lucrative. So much so, that it's actually a wonder that there aren't more alleged masks, bloodied garments, locks of hair, etc. The people who are in such trade (including those who made death and life masks for a living) are in the business of believing that such items exist and passing on that belief to a paying public. Whether they are scam artists, merely duped by others, or a little of both, I don't know. But since the only claims for such things comes from people connected to making money off of them, I can't buy into any of the masks, coats, etc. One more reason: remember how urgent the need to obliterate the Robespierrists was. It would have been serious business to assert that it would be a good idea to make a mask. That would not have amused any of the Thermidoreans. As for a life mask, I can't picture Robespierre undergoing such an indignity without every one of his enemies screaming about it as soon as it was done. Yet only postmortem tales of masks exist. The only reason for believing such tales is resorting to "it's not impossible." That's just not convincig enough for me.

And yet, I've been told at the Carnavalet Museum that the lock of hair has very good evidence supporting its authentcity. I also asked why it was white and was told that it was the powder used to render hair fashionably white. My comment was something to the effect that they must have stuck that powder on with something nasty because it sure looks completely and totally white. I was told that's how it was. My natural inclination is to be very skeptical and I'm still not convinced that that hair is Robespierre's. The Carnavalet did not produce the convincing evidence they have, so I can't judge for myself. I should probably just trust their expertise on it--as I trust their expertise on believing the other artifacts in other places are hooey.

[identity profile] marieclaire08.livejournal.com 2008-09-18 05:00 pm (UTC)(link)
Ew. I just visited the site victoriavandal links in her initial post here. What an amazingly creepy hobby. Am I intolerant and hyper-judgmental in thinking this is a very twisted person? Ew.